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Thread: Transponder Maps: Domestic, Mexico, Latin ~ Data 10/18/2017

  1. #301
    I have to think the problems on 119 must be somehow limited to your setup. The "signal strength" reported by Directv receivers is calculated based on SNR/CNR, which is in turn essentially based on bit error rate. A high error rate should have everyone's tpn 26 number on 119 way down. Maybe try a different dish to receive the data, in case the 119 feedhorn is having issues?

  2. #302
    Data Miner Tom Speer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slice1900 View Post
    I have to think the problems on 119 must be somehow limited to your setup. The "signal strength" reported by Directv receivers is calculated based on SNR/CNR, which is in turn essentially based on bit error rate. A high error rate should have everyone's tpn 26 number on 119 way down. Maybe try a different dish to receive the data, in case the 119 feedhorn is having issues?
    I would agree with you, except that Doctor J and I are both experiencing the problem on two totally separate installations, about 970 miles apart. I use two dishes, one with a legacy SL5 connected to a Skywalker-1 for collecting the data. My regular dish uses a SL3RB SWM LNB. The SWM LNB is incompatible with the Skywalker, and I have no DirecTV STB compatible with a legacy LNB anymore, so I can't check SS from 119 with a STB, yet. In about three weeks I will be able to try other configurations when I migrate to my winter home. There, I again have two dishes, but a wider selection of LNB's to try.

    What is interesting is that the Skywalker reports a SNR around 13 dB for all of the CONUS transponders on 119, and for nearby spot beams., including the one for my DMA. It also reports a signal percentage, which AFAIK, is related to the error rate. The transponders on 119 differ greatly in that reading, with essentially the same SNR. The problem affects transponders 26, 28, 30, and 32 to varying degrees, with 26 running at 30%.

    I have a much lower SNR for 110, because I am well north of its beam footprint, but I get a signal percentage over 90%.
    Tom Speer, also known as tomspeer46. The curious otter is still around, but hasn't been seen lately.

  3. #303
    Well that rules out equipment problems then. It is very odd. If it was an uplink issue you'd think they'd simply uplink from another location, so that points more towards D7S itself. Though I can't imagine what sort of a problem could cause it to just affect some of the CONUS even tpns. Very strange.

    Maybe it is deliberate and Directv is just testing something? Similar to the low readings we've seen on certain D14 tpns at times.

  4. #304
    Data Miner Tom Speer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slice1900 View Post
    Well that rules out equipment problems then. It is very odd. If it was an uplink issue you'd think they'd simply uplink from another location, so that points more towards D7S itself. Though I can't imagine what sort of a problem could cause it to just affect some of the CONUS even tpns. Very strange.

    Maybe it is deliberate and Directv is just testing something? Similar to the low readings we've seen on certain D14 tpns at times.
    New information:

    We are receiving the data stream from the transponder fine. The PIDs carrying programs have no errors. On TPN 26, only the PIDs higher than 0x810 are showing continuity errors. Unfortunately that is where the APG data for Net 3 exists. This is not a satellite transmission problem. This is a corrupt data stream problem.

    [Edit] Our best guess is that the statistical multiplexer for 119 TPN 26 has been set to prioritize the PIDs for the live channels, while starving the APG data for bandwidth. This was probably set inadvertently, or if purposely, a cruel test of some sort.
    Last edited by Tom Speer; 10-15-2017 at 02:41 AM.
    Tom Speer, also known as tomspeer46. The curious otter is still around, but hasn't been seen lately.

  5. #305
    Edgecutter inkahauts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Speer View Post
    New information:

    We are receiving the data stream from the transponder fine. The PIDs carrying programs have no errors. On TPN 26, only the PIDs higher than 0x810 are showing continuity errors. Unfortunately that is where the APG data for Net 3 exists. This is not a satellite transmission problem. This is a corrupt data stream problem.
    Maybe you need to file a ce report on that!

  6. #306
    Data Miner Tom Speer's Avatar
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    Just after I edited my previous post, I checked 119 tpn 26 again. DirecTV has corrected the problem. Doctor J should have no problem capturing the data on Wednesday.
    Tom Speer, also known as tomspeer46. The curious otter is still around, but hasn't been seen lately.

  7. #307
    Strange that it is even possible for that to occur, let alone go on for so long. You'd think they'd have processes in place that would catch that sort of thing immediately.

  8. #308
    As a brief refresher to this system. .

    Is it that "fast PIDs" for the APG data of CONUS programs on 119W that specifically comes from tp. 26 as a dedicated transponder?

    And at the same time, there are "slow PIDs" transmitted from any number of 119W CONUS transponders to mirror APG data from 101W so the (few nowadays I guess) SL-5 legacy installations can receive APG data while viewing programs on 103W?

  9. #309
    Data Miner Tom Speer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HoTat2 View Post
    As a brief refresher to this system. .

    Is it that "fast PIDs" for the APG data of CONUS programs on 119W that specifically comes from tp. 26 as a dedicated transponder?

    And at the same time, there are "slow PIDs" transmitted from any number of 119W CONUS transponders to mirror APG data from 101W so the (few nowadays I guess) SL-5 legacy installations can receive APG data while viewing programs on 103W?
    It certainly is not a "dedicated transponder". D7S TPN 26 carries a 30.5 Mbps digital data stream. The stream is made up of packets, each of which carries a PID, which identify the particular stream the packet belongs to. The data rate of each stream varies over time, which is how statistical multiplexing works. TPN 26 carries 13 SD video streams, and 18 audio streams (5 of which are audio only SONIC channels). The Fast APG PID, now that they have their stat mux configured properly, carries data at about 100 kbps. The "Slow" APG PIDs are also there on a high PID numbers, running around 10- 40 kbps. The slow PIDs on that transponder were also affected just as the fast one was for these past two weeks.

    I have only been involved in actually looking at the APG data streams for less than a year, since I volunteered to make Doctor J's job less complex, faster and easier. I have never looked at the contents of the slow PID. I am too impatient, and the others in our team decided there was no new information in the Slow PIDs for our weekly data collection. (see further info below)
    Last edited by Tom Speer; 10-16-2017 at 04:58 PM.
    Tom Speer, also known as tomspeer46. The curious otter is still around, but hasn't been seen lately.

  10. #310
    Data Miner Tom Speer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HoTat2 View Post
    As a brief refresher to this system. .

    Is it that "fast PIDs" for the APG data of CONUS programs on 119W that specifically comes from tp. 26 as a dedicated transponder?

    And at the same time, there are "slow PIDs" transmitted from any number of 119W CONUS transponders to mirror APG data from 101W so the (few nowadays I guess) SL-5 legacy installations can receive APG data while viewing programs on 103W?
    I took some time to look at how the Slow APG PIDs work. All Mpeg2 transponders carry the same 36 slow PIDs with APG data for all MPEG2 (SD) channels on any Domestic satellite, including 95W. That allows an old SD receiver with one tuner to get the guide data, whatever it is tuned to. It is not just CONUS transponders, it is ALL mpeg2 transponders. Thank you for your question, I learned something new.
    Tom Speer, also known as tomspeer46. The curious otter is still around, but hasn't been seen lately.

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